A conversation with Ron Ellis 

Ron Ellis is widely regarded as one of the finest pickup builders working today. But before he ever wound a pickup coil, he spent decades immersed in scientific research at some of the most advanced laboratories in the country. His unusual background—combining high-level experimental physics with a deep, hands-on understanding of materials—has given him a unique perspective on vintage pickups, manufacturing history, and why old guitars sound and feel the way they do. 

Early Career in Fusion Research

“I started at Lawrence Livermore Labs back in ’79,” Ron says. “I was working on the National Magnetic Fusion Program, where we were building two machines; TMX (Tandem Mirror Experiment), and the MFTF (Mirror Fusion Test Facility), which was the largest mirror magnetic fusion machine in the world at the time.”

He did everything from machining, welding, designing/building diagnostics, and winding large superconducting copper-niobium Yin-Yang shaped coils that were nearly five feet across. “Here I was, 21 years old, winding these massive DC coils for Fusion Reactors, with half inch square superconducting wire/cable. It’s kind of ironic—I was winding these huge coils back then and had no idea it would ever circle back to the coils I’m winding today.”

Ron didn’t follow a traditional academic path. “At Livermore Labs, I was taking mechanical engineering classes through a learning program at UC Davis, but I never finished getting a formal degree. I was just involved and integrated into the engineering system at Livermore, learning everything firsthand by actually doing the work, designing and building things.”

Early on in his career, Ron was involved with building and operating diagnostics for the Fusion Reactors. “I worked on plasma viewing infrared camera systems, plasma temperature measuring sensors, optical filtering viewing cameras, microwave, RF, and neutral beam plasma heating systems. I eventually was doing most of the designing, engineering, and building of these systems… I’m very fortunate, in my 44 year career at the lab, I was surrounded by brilliant people.”

In 1986, Ron and his wife Mona moved from Livermore to San Diego to continue his work on the National Fusion Energy Program in a collaboration with General Atomics. “The DIII-D program is a worldwide collaborative fusion program—a globally collaborative experiment in Magnetic Fusion Energy. Scientists from all over the world travel to DIII-D to run various experiments. These machines operate with plasmas reaching up to 150 million degrees centigrade, which is roughly 10 times hotter than the core of our sun.”

This is where Ron’s materials testing background came in. “I started doing a lot of testing on the materials used inside DIII-D and other reactors around the world. I was doing studies on melting points, reflective surfaces, outgassing properties, and materials prep for everything going inside the DIII-D machine.”

From Fusion Reactors to Guitars

One day, a friend called him from L.A. “He said, ‘We’ve got some parts from one of Hendrix’s Strats—frets, saddles, and pickups. I know you do spectroscopy testing at work, would you mind testing them?’”

Ron says this was his introduction to intersecting guitars and science. “I ran them through our spectrometry lab with the help of a brilliant guy who ran the shop there. He didn’t know a thing about guitars, but he was really excited knowing that these were actual parts from Jimi’s guitar. That was kind of the foot in the door start to it all—combining music and science for the first time.”

Not long after, Ron bought a ’63 Telecaster in pieces and brought it to Alan Hamel, who had recently left the Fender Custom Shop. From there, friendships, collaborations, and pickup-making began to unfold.

Building a Database of Vintage Pickups

When Nacho Baños began researching his now-famous Blackguard Book, he reached out to Alan Hamel and Ron. Nacho soon discovered Ron’s spectroscopy expertise and sent a box of early pickups for analysis. “I tested the magnets, baseplates, neck covers, and the wire… I gave the data back to Nacho, which he used in the Blackguard Book. Nacho is a great guy, it was an honor being able to add a small part to the book!”

That opened the door for more. “Friends and collectors started sending me old pickups to test. I started buying old broken pickups off of eBay, testing them and documenting my finds. Iconic players like Bill Hullett, Redd Volkaert, and other session and collector guys helped with advice and their thoughts on what a great sounding pickup was. I started seeing patterns—bridge pickups from mid ’51 into ’52 were mostly Alnico 3, without any cobalt. So technically, they weren’t Alnico, but AlNi 3, yet labeled under the AlNiCo type.”

Challenges with Modern Materials

Ron’s curiosity extended to modern magnets and wire. The results, he says, weren’t encouraging. “When I reached out to one manufacturer, they told me they make magnets the same exact way today as they did for Fender and Gibson back in the ‘50s and ‘60s. I tested them using multimillion-dollar equipment, and it didn’t match up. Not even close.”

When he asked manufacturers if they could replicate old formulas, they refused. Certification standards introduced in the ’60s and ’70s made non-standard alloys off-limits, even for guitar parts. Eventually, Ron found a family-run overseas supplier willing to match his specifications.

When analyzing copper wire, similar challenges arose. “I’ve tested a lot of the copper wire used in the ’50s-’60s, which had more impurities vs the purer copper used today. If I wind a coil with the old wire vs. new wire, with the same diameter and number of winds, the inductance can be quite different. So to get the same sound and feel of the older wire, I have to wind the current day wire pickup a bit differently.”

Variability as the “Magic”

To Ron, the inconsistencies are what make vintage pickups compelling. “They’re inconsistent, non-uniform, and many times crudely made. That’s what makes them interesting. They were made from the hands of many different people, and you see it in the look and way they were made.”

He points to the winding process as an example. “There has been so much written about the old autowinding machines used at Gibson and Fender—Leesona, Meteor, etc. Even though these machines were considered Autowinders… because of the varying wire diameter and tension, the wire bounced around between the tensioner and bobbin, creating an uneven scatter-like pattern. I’ve rewound a lot of old P90’s, PAF’s, and Patent’s that have this uneven wind pattern.”

That variability, he says, is the true “magic” of old pickups.

A Family Business

Although he’s one of the most successful and well-known pickup makers, Ron is modest about his role. “Pickups are only as good as the guitar they’re in. You can take a magical PAF and drop it into a dead sounding/feeling guitar—it’ll still sound somewhat dead.”

Today, Ron Ellis Pickups remains a small, family-driven business—Ron, his son Alan, daughter Audrey, and three other employees. Each batch of magnets and wire is tested before production, ensuring consistency for players who want their next set to sound just like the first.

Ron laughs at the idea of mystique. “A pickup is just a little magnetic passive coil device, it’s certainly not rocket science making it. It’s just in the foundation of doing it all correctly, the materials, build recipe, repetition, feel, QC, and having the desire and passion in the whole process.”

When asked how much of what he does is art versus science, Ron smiles. “It’s a balance of both. The science tells you what the possibilities are, the art is the desire and dedication to actually do it, that’s where the tone is created.”

Advising Vintage Verified

Ron plays a critical role in advising Vintage Verified. He points out that, rather than simply studying the finished product, you must also study all of the processes that contributed to it. Ron provides Vintage Verified unmatched experience and knowledge that is helpful far beyond the analysis of guitar pickups.